By zack on Sunday, February 17, 2002 - 01:27 pm:

i've tried to get hold of this doctor called Pomeroy in Arizona as I heard he was very good but when I talked to his secretary she refused to tell me what solutions he uses.

Does any one have any idea why when so many others advertise it ?

thanks

Zack

By Park Griffin on Monday, February 18, 2002 - 05:01 am:

His e-mail address is kentpomeroy@worldnet.att.net

Zack, there is a right way and a wrong way to approach a Doctor. Calling his office up and asking what solution he uses is not the right way. You should, if you haven't done so, is ask him if he treats the condition that you may have. If he does then you set up a consultation and visit with him and then you may ask what solution he uses. He may use different solution "recipes" for different findings.

Trust me on this one: Statistics would show if you had a medical practice whereby one of the doctors performs prolotherapy and the office consists of 4 doctors, 10 nurses, and 4 secretaries; the one doctor who does prolotherapy most likely is the only person who knows prolotherapy and believes in it.

Park

By zack on Thursday, February 21, 2002 - 10:44 am:

yes but he trouble with that is ( based on esperince ) only morruhate rally works so IF I travel all the way over there from here ( I'm not in the US ) then it means I may end up paying a helluva lot just to get answer he could easily tell me,

Also i like input in whats being done , I like to think I can choose a different solution if one isn;t working and not have it chosen for me.

I do not esp trust doctors and my experince shows that a lot of them will at times take advantage and milk a situation for more money by giving you a weaker solution which takes more time to work .

i see your idea but i know of no doctors who just uses one standard approach and who isn't willing to change even if he has one preferred one.

In short even if he does have a preferred solution for my problem why am I not entitled to know the other options ?

It's like walking into a salesroom and telling the salesman i want to buy a car but only being shown and offered the one he wants me to buy.

Would you travel halfway across the world to go to someone if you knew there was chance that this guy might not have the only solution that has helped you as backup if all else fails ?

By Karin on Thursday, February 21, 2002 - 06:33 pm:

Zack, this treatment isn't done in one session.
You didn't say what's wrong with you. Is it
the wrist, knee, back? Most people need several
treatments over a period of a few month or more.
If Park will read this post, he can explain this
a lot better.It's a healing process and it will
take most likely more than one session.

Hope this will help you and I tell you the
dextrose etc. is working on me.

By Margareth on Friday, February 22, 2002 - 12:34 am:

Zack, send the guy an e-mail, explain your situation and ask him personally about the solution. I am very interested to hear about your plans and how they are coming about... I live on the otherside of the world aswell and I too have been concidering going to the U.S. for treatment. Where are you from? e-mail me if you like...

By Park Griffin on Friday, February 22, 2002 - 02:56 pm:

Zack, unless you have all ready had prolotherapy, and have tried both glucose and sodium morrhuate you can't assume that sodium morrhuate works better. Believe it or not, sodium morrhuate, has a less statistical success rate than glucose based solution. The one thing that I haven't mentioned yet is this: Inflammation is good when it comes to prolotherapy. Inflammation is one of the steps of the natural healing process, blood supply formation is the next. The added circulation in the area brings needed collagen to the site for tissue reconstruction.

THIS IS IMPORTANT!!! What would happen (AND IT DOES!), if the inflammation is at a high enough degree to choke off the new blood supply??? Well, circulation is halted and the collagen can't get to the injured site. Guess what??? All that you have is this: swelling and stiffness. Some people will say wow, this sodium morrhuate is better than this glucose!!! You can feel it work. I'm much more stiff than with the glucose prolo.

Prolotherapy takes patience, Zack. Man, I really respect your drive, but you need to be assertive, not aggressive.

If you are travelling long distance for prolo, I would consider Dr. Faber. He specializes in doing sessions spaced really close together. Also, look up Dr. Ongley, he is a respected prolotherapist and he is located "south of the border".

Good Luck!!! Park

By Zack on Monday, March 04, 2002 - 07:34 pm:

Hello,

this is getting more and more complex.

I read here morruhate was good so tried it last year with dr Faber , he blew out my joints after injecting me in the illeolumbar .

Up until then the morruhate was having great immediate affects , long term affects though I can't say because as I said he blew out my joints.

I was seeing him x2 a week for just over a 2 months.

I had the dextrose from dr hauser , seemingly great long term affects , but ...

and this is the big but

I got was chronically ill for almsot 2 whole yrs afterwards, stil have problems to this day .

i since learned the soy protein powder I took and the high protein diet along with the solution may have infact caused my problems, and based on the symptoms it describes it might of been what caused mine.

I have all in all been to 3 doctors.

Djuric - who was not willing to treat me , said I was a lost case , had to live with it ,and that faber and hauser were purely in it for the money ( think what you like but this is what he told me )

Hauser - whose diet typing advice I would never follow again , not least because high protein diets to cause severe digestion problems

Faber - Who said he did not agree with Hausers no pain no gain phiolsphoy and doesn;t use dextrose , made Ongley out to be somewhat of lunatic ( his own description ) said he no problem with Hauser though and had talked to him
Said that prolo solutions could pull joints into place ( though I don't agree entirely )and that contradictory to Djuric I suffered mild hypermobility .


So there you have it ..

If I was to put my money where my mouth is i'd given hauser 0 as a doctor because of the chronic health i now suffer , but he certainly seemed the man when it came to helping the shoulder.

Faber - will have your neck / back and hips feelings like cast iron



I don't mean to be doomcasting but as I know what it's like to be in this position and as other have already been helpful to me ( i talk to one guy i meet here who also had his joints blown out by a misplaced injection ) I think it's important
i let everyone know my experince so they know what they're getting into .

it's not so black and white at all , i wish it was but I am almsot more confused than ever.

Prolo might have cured me last year if it were not for tha misplacement and then you have to ask yourself why he injected me there and caused that to happen if he is experinced ?

I am not trying to put him or any one else down but all this really did happen to me and it has cost me dearly as it has undone almost 6 yrs of rehab .

I am currently considering seeing Wheaton for month on trial run , my joints are so bad now that I need something anyone before it collapsse like the eiffel tower .

I might go back to either faber or hauser , though I think I'd be more inclined to try faber first because I am so scared of my experince with Hauser .

I wish there were was a an easier way of knowing , but it's like the choics of 3 evils

The question is what can you afford , in my case
I can't .

I am really that desperate and scared to hell of going through whats taken me almost 3 yrs to become managable and last year certainly did nothing to instill my confidence either.

Inspite of all this I am serisouly considering getting to the bottom or root cause rather than just getting injections and might risk it all going to the MAYO clinic in order to this .

This is not great opition really either but I do think that in my case there might be reason for this ie. toxic exposure ( copper salts digestions ) plus my abnormal symptoms like thermosensivity and the fact I was getting worse isnpite of all the rehab and improvement even before the last years injetions.

I hope i don't put people off , every one is unique but ( if I had the money ) i would go see a endocrinologist , rhumatologist etc before I'd get prolo , if you can afford too .

There is professor here in the Uk Prog Grahame down in Lodon that is an expert in hypermobility it was my wish to try and see him first before I go anywhere to see if I am really hypermobile or not..

My joints are getting really bad though , and as each day passes I feel more is being undone so I will prob end up at least trying wheaton .

I am scared to deaht of getting dextrose again , i mean really scared but I feel that unless i do I will never know if it's the dextrose , or the dextrose and protein powder so i plan or possiblly gettin it again to find .

thanks for replying Park and to every one else.

I really wish you all the best and would love to hear all your success stories .

the more information different infomation we get , hopefully the easier it will be to make the decision.

Zack

By Park Griffin on Tuesday, March 05, 2002 - 02:36 pm:

Zack, how many of the Doctor's performed the injections under x-ray guidance? You should not have had any blown joints, especially if they were done with X-ray guidance. Did you see Dr. Djuric when he was located in Lousiana? He's in Ohio now and I know him quite well. If he stated that your condition was too severe for prolo to work, I'd tend to believe him. He is such a people person, I find it hard to believe that he was so blunt with you. Especially the fact that he bad mouthed Faber and Hauser. He's worked with Hauser in the past. One thing about prolo and Hauser, though, he would like to sell you a ton of supplements, but a good balanced diet including complete proteins is as good as pills.

Which joint is blown? Or was it a disc L4-L5 L5-S1??? What happened, did Faber miss the ligament and destroy the disk or what??? I have a problem believing that you understand your underlying condition and it seems that you are just simply detiorating and the prolo neither helped nor hurt you.

I'm really sorry about your problems, but I know it's hard to accept the advice of someone who tells you that you are too far gone for prolo to be effective. Dr. Djuric would have had you try prolo if He thought there was even a small chance that it would work.

Again, injecting the iliolumbar ligaments should not blow a joint even if misplaced. The iliolumbar ligaments attach the lumbar spine to the ilium, there is no joint to blow only disks.

You may want to look up Dr. Klein and EEK in California, they are pretty good, too.

Ongley is a nut, but he's good.

Zack, I could go on and on. I would like to help if I can, but you must explain your condition. You seem to be filled with misconceptions.

Good Luck, Park

By Park Griffin on Tuesday, March 05, 2002 - 03:00 pm:

For anyone reading Zack's posts, I would like to explain something about prolotherapy, specifically regarding the doctors, who perform it.

Dr. Djuric is a Certified Physical Medicine and Rehabilitation Doctor and holds a Fellowship in Sport's Medicine. He is as conventional as they come, but he likes to perform prolotherapy as it improves patient outcomes. He has a radiology room right at his office and performs a host of conventional injection techniques other than prolo. His practice is not simpy prolotherapy.

On the other hand, there are plenty of Doctor's out there whose practice is 90-100 percent prolotherapy. This does not mean that they are not good prolotherapists, but it does suggest that beyond prolo they don't offer much. Their livelyhood depends on prolotherapy. They ARE in it for the money, but that doesn't mean that they are crooks.

One last thing about prolo. Like acupuncture, many conventional doctor's have found some benefit in it, but it is not the cure all that some would like you to believe. Prolo is the same way. All prolo can do for the most part is activate the bodies natural healing process for repair of soft tissue. Nothing more and nothing less. Also, I would not believe Zack when he states that a misplaced injection blew a joint. There are many types of injections that are intradiscal and also injected directly into joints. Bottom line, though, if some one blew my joint with an injection, one, I would never try it again, and two, I would file a law suit.

Park